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PHKeeper: On behalf of Jeff Barringer and all of us at Dog Hobbyist, I'm very pleased to welcome Dr. Heidi Mier DVM CVA to our Ninth Annual Chat Week

PHKeeper: Dr. Heidi Mier practices Traditional Chinese Veterinary Medicine in an Integrative Small Animal Veterinary practice she has developed in Ann Arbor, Michigan. Dr. Mier graduated from the University of Wisconsin School of Veterinary Medicine in 1988, and subsequently completed an Internship at Cornell University in Small Animal Medicine and Surgery. She then went into private practice in Southeastern Michigan. She transitioned into an independent house-call Acupuncture practice in 2002-3, and since last spring has developed an independent Integrative Veterinary practice in an Ann Arbor Specialty clinic. Dr. Mier is certified in Small Animal and Equine Acupuncture through the Chi Institute in Florida in 2002-2003, and has completed coursework for Chinese Herbal certification. Her methods of practice primarily involve integrating Western and Eastern Veterinary Medicine through diet, acupuncture, herbal therapy, and traditional therapy where appropriate. Her hobbies include agility for fun with her Finnish Lapphund, and trail-riding her Tennessee Walker mare.

fireladie: I have a 7 year old doxie with no clinical signs of back trouble... but suffers greatly from pain... is this an instance I should use acupuncture? No slipped disks, no spinal cord compression... the vet has ruled it all out.

DrHeidiMier: Can you tell where the pain is coming from? If it is coming from the back, then yes, acupuncture can be very helpful in preventing further problems with the back.

DrHeidiMier: Only an MRI , CT scan, or myelogram can actually completely ruleout disc compression.

PNYC_NYIfan: Can acupuncture help relieve any anxiety-related cat behavior problems (low hyperstimulation threshhold)

DrHeidiMier: Yes, acupuncture and herbal therapy can be very effective in some cases of anxiety in cats, dogs, horses, and people.

mydarlingmok_nr: Hi Dr. Mier. Thanks so much for being willing to answer our questions. My question is about the safety of using multiple Chinese herbal formulas at the same time. My 16.5 yr-old Min Pin, Mokie, has been on Rehmannia Six for kidney disease for about a year and Ban Xia Bai Zhu Tian Ma Tang for seizures for about two months. I'm taking her off the Ban Xia Bai Zhu Tian Ma Tang but am considering putting her on Marrow Plus for anemia. Is it safe to use this formula at the same time as using Rehmannia Six or Eight? Thanks :-)

mydarlingmok_nr: Marrow Plus ingredients?

DrHeidiMier: I think it is important to be under the care of a veterinarian trained in TCVM (traditional chinese vet. med.) to understand the effects of combining such herbals. Often the same herbals are not used as the pattern, or TCVM exam may change.

DrHeidiMier: Chinese herbal each have individual qualities and temperatures, so the selection of herbals may differ based on a pattern even if the diagnosis is the same.

mydarlingmok_nr: Ideally, that would be great. I'm seeing an acupuncturist/vet already, but not sure she knows about such interactions.

DrHeidiMier: I have looked at Marrow Plus, and it has a large number of Chinese herbals in it. I tend to use classical Chinese herbal formulas (this one is more modern).

mydarlingmok_nr: Right, I do understand that. My acu/vet recommended the seizure formula, but I just looked tonight at the ingredients (thought they'd all be Chinese herbs I wouldn't recognize) and it contains licorice, which is contraindicated for my dog's Cushings. Sigh...

DrHeidiMier: Licorice is often used to harmonize formulas, and in small amounts, may not be a problem in many cases.

mydarlingmok_nr: OK, I gather this is not the type of question for a vet who has not seen my dog personally. Do you do phone consults?

DrHeidiMier: I do not generally, as it is important to examine the tongue and pulse of patients in order to prescribe a formula for optimal benefits. It is complicated.

Sarasmushu: I have a 2 yr old Lab with mild hip dysplasia, just diagnosed in November, he has gotten stiffer over the Winter. Will Acupuncture help in keeping it from progressing as quickly has it has been? Or will it just help keep him comfortable and able to move?

DrHeidiMier: There are some very basic Chinese herbal formulas that you may want to ask your acupuncture vet about, like Rehmannia 6, and Si Wu Tang, which are basic kidney and blood tonics. Because Acupuncture can help with pain as well as with healing, this may delay the need for NSAIDs. I also recommend basic joint supplements.

Sarasmushu: Thank you. Thats just the answer Iwas looking for.

spidermom_nr: How do you go about getting the cat to sit still during needling? Do you just insert needle and remove? Or just hold the animal still until done?

DrHeidiMier: Believe it or not, most cats are very accepting of acupuncture. Sometimes giving Rescue Remedy for a few days prior can help as well. An irritable or dominant cat may be difficult to treat.

spidermom_nr: Thank you.

DrHeidiMier: Cats are very energetic animals, and seem to respond very quickly to acupuncture; the same is true for horses.

fireladie: Do you have any advice for preparatory training for your pets to receive acupuncture? To get them to calm down, etc.? And.... is it something you need to prepare your pets for?

DrHeidiMier: The first session is often a learning experience for the animal, as it doesn't understand yet the effects; as there is a cumulative effect of treatments, they often learn due to endorphins released during needling to relax more quickly. Rescue Remedy may help as well. I spend a good period of time examining the animal and talking through a treatment plan, and this seems to help them calm down as well.

EquineMT: What kind of joint supplements do you recommend? Does that recommendation differ with a patient who has degenerative joint problems of some sort vs. someone wanting to use a joint supplement preventatively? (I know this is dog chat, but would your answer be the same for performance horses too?) I have a 9 month old Australian shepherd pup-no problems, but wonder about when/if to start joint supplements as a preventative measure. I plan to do casual agility with him-but he is far from casual in play and work even at this young age....(also have an 11 year old warmblood mare in serious dressage training who receives IV Legend and Adequan-is a daily joint supplement overkill? Helpful?) . Thanks :-)

DrHeidiMier: The constitution of the animal will determine also how quickly an animal relaxes. For instance, a dominant toy breed will often not relax as much as an earthy Golden.

DrHeidiMier: I like to use a good diet, glucosamine, and omega 3 Fatty acids (fish oil, or flax) in most cases.

DrHeidiMier: It appears that taking glucosamine PRIOR to an injury will help in the healing.

EquineMT: Good...thanks :)

DrHeidiMier: I really like Platinum Performance for horses.

PNYC_NYIfan: You said that a dominant or irritable cat might be difficult. What about a cat who thinks he's dominant, and who is very jumpy?

EquineMT: good to know about the P. performance...thanks again!

DrHeidiMier: I would use the Rescue Remedy a few times daily for a few days prior at home, and place a few needles to see what the cat allowed. Aquapuncture, or injection into acupuncture points can be done if the cat doesn't like sitting with needles in for 20 min.

PNYC_NYIfan: thanks

Deerhounds: I know that ideally, TCM seeks to prevent disease rather than always be trying to treat it after it manifests. But so many people first discover TCM because they have a very sick pet who has failed on conventional therapies. So often, these are dogs with really serious diseases such as cancer. What has been your experience of working with these animals, especially cancer cases?

DrHeidiMier: My practice consists of both many geriatrics as well as many cancer cases. Each case must be looked at as an individual. Acupuncture may be used to help with symptoms (poor appetite, pain, nausea), as well as to help the immune system. I often combine it with diet changes, herbals, and traditional therapies where indicated.

Deerhounds: thank you

Leanne_nr: I have a cat with renal failure, and I've been hearing about so many different approaches on the CRF kitty email list and website, and I'm getting very confused. Is Chinese medicine and acupuncture helpful for this, or should I focus mostly on diet, or does Chinese medicine include diet?

DrHeidiMier: Yes, kidney disease can be helped by acupuncture and herbal therapy, in addition to diet. Food therapy is part of TCVM.

PHBully: What is the difference between aquapuncture and acupuncture?

DrHeidiMier: Acupuncture is the placement of needles; aquapuncture is the injection of something into an acupuncture point. Often Vitamin B12 is used, but other substances (eg Adequan) can be used this way. The substance injected stimulates the acupuncture point for hours as it absorbs, and may increase the effect of the treatment.

PHBully: Thank you

DrHeidiMier: Electroacupuncture is another way to increase the effect of the treatments, and is very helpful for painful conditions, as well as paralysis.

fireladie: What is the difference between acupressure and acupuncture? What is the different response in terms of how an animals body reacts to each? Similar question. lol

DrHeidiMier: Acupressure is pressure with the finger into an acupuncture point, and will stimulate the point if this is done for a period of time. It generally is less strong at getting an effect than with needles, but can be taught to owners to do, and be done many times a day. The stimulation by needles, injections, or pressure must be specific in location.

fireladie: Thanks :)

PHCatByte: That's exactly what I was going to ask you, Dr. Mier, if it was something that an owner could learn to do to help out in between times, as I know that humans can do acupressure on their own kind.

DrHeidiMier: Yes, this can be a good adjunct to needling.

PNYC_NYIfan: This same cat had a pelvic fracture as a kitten (before his 1st family adopted him); the shelter cage tag said he did have a risk of osteoarthritis later in life .... would glucosamine now help him, or is the fact it's made from fish raise his FUS risk?

DrHeidiMier: Glucosamine is very safe for cats. Also, weight control, and good diet.

PNYC_NYIfan: Justin's problem is being underweight.

DrHeidiMier: Then a good diet of canned food.

Skaket: Does it hurt the animal when the procedure is done?

DrHeidiMier: There is a tingle when a needle is initially placed, and endorphins are released by needling, so most times animals are tolerant. Each subsequent treatment is often tolerated better. There are occasionally animals that do not like the tingle. If this continues each treatment, perhaps acupuncture is not for them. It really can depend on the constitution of the pet.

Skaket: Thank you.

PHKeeper: Is it gaining in popularity this procedures?

DrHeidiMier: Yes, many people are aware and seeking nontraditional therapies for themselves and their pets.

PHKeeper: thank you

PHCatByte: Is there any place people could learn more about TCVM and veterinary acupuncture, and locate practitioners in their area?

DrHeidiMier: Acupuncture is great for chronic conditions.

DrHeidiMier: Yes; there are lists at www.tcvm.com, as well as www.ivas.org.

DrHeidiMier: Also, the AHVMA has a list of vets who practice complementary therapies.

fireladie: Is acupuncture something you can have done to your pet "just cause" maybe for preventive treatment... or because it feels good to them?

DrHeidiMier: A good TCVM practitioner may detect problems before they produce symptoms.

fireladie: OK, thanks again. :)

DrHeidiMier: Acupuncture is helpful for painful conditions, as well as internal cases (eg for diarrhea cases). Chinese herbals can be used in place of medications in many cases.

PHKeeper: Any age limits on procedures?

DrHeidiMier: No, although a young patient may be treated more aggressively than a very weak older patient (who needs less stimulation for effect). For acute problems in a young animal, one or two treatments may resolve the problem, whereas in chronic cases, ongoing treatment is often indicated.

PHKeeper: Thank you

PHKeeper: On behalf of Doghobbyist.com, Jeff B, and myself, I want to take a moment to thank Dr. Heidi Mier for being part of our chat week. Dr. Mier, thanks for taking the time out to chat with us on acupuncture!

DrHeidiMier: You are welcome.

PHKeeper: Thank you Dr.Mier for all the information and your time

PHKeeper: Dr.Mier hope you will join us again in future chats

DrHeidiMier: I would be honored.